Author Topic: Interesting Photos  (Read 17016 times)

Dale Tanski

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Interesting Photos
« on: January 06, 2011, 08:12:11 PM »
I have decided to post a few photos of some unusual places on the boat for those that are considering work in those areas.



This is what I found under my sea hood.  The lower corner had a large mud wasp nest and you can see an old companionway lock a previous owner lost further back. Keep this in mind if your lock goes missing!



This is what the deck looks like under one of the dorade boxes.  The yellow tubes are the breather pipes.  The sealent on my forward pipe failed and the tube slid down.  This resulted in a leak in between the deck and inner liner.  The water collected in the lens of the light in the galley under the deck.  The tubes are fiberglass.



Ever wonder what's in the deck?  My head has a 10" x 10" Bomar vent hatch in the deck.  Here you can see the balsa coring.  It is about 3/4" thick. You can see the deck layup, the core and the layup of the backside of the deck.  The inner liner fiberglass is the layer you can see directly below the deck structure. The rail in the background is my staysail traveler track.



This is the underside of the seahood.  The blue item is an aluminum fabrication which spans the opening and provides the strength for the mainsheet blocks.  You can see the extra web where the center block mounts. It maybe worth removing your hood just to repaint this fabrication.  As you can see it was a bit scuzzy.



Here is a little better shot of the extra web for the block mounting.  The bolts you see hold the block padeye.



Ever wonder how thick you cabin sides were?  The inner liner and the outer cabin structure are glassed together at the ports. The overall thickness is approximately 3/8" to 1/2".



Here is what she looks like .  She is a cutter rigged ketch or staysail ketch depending on how you look at it.  The inner forestay and clubfoot staysail were a factory option.

Good rebuilding... 
Dale Tanski
"Maruska"
Pearson 365 Cutter Ketch
1976 Hull #40
Buffalo, N.Y.

Henri Hali

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2011, 10:50:16 AM »
Dale
Very interesting photos.
When the weather breaks I'll have a look at what's under my sea hood.
The aluminum fabrication alone warrants a peak!

Is there any chance you can resend the photos of the Good Old Boat articles you posted back in the day?
I found them invaluable in stumbling through my endless list of projects. That posting was the reason I finally subscribed to GOB.
The price had always held me back. Now, I would not be without it. I value it as much as Practical Sailor.

By the way,is that a water heater in the first photo? I'm in the middle of replacing my original Raritan with a unit that looks a lot like the picture.  Silly me thought I'd done all of the measuring and figuring and technical support inquiries to make the replacement  a piece of cake. It would be if I cut an 13.5"X13.5" opening in the starboard side of the hull. If asked I can tell people it's part of my new AC unit. So what if I can only dock on the port side!

If it is a waterheater maybeyou could take a shot of that installation as well.

Happy New year my friend.

Henri
Henri Hali
S/V Windrider
1980 Pearson 365 Hull # 316

Dale Tanski

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2011, 09:20:17 PM »
Henri,

Yes that is a water heater in the background of the first picture.  It was manufactured by Atlantic which has since gone out of business.  All stainless, inside and out.  It has a round tube inner tank with spherical ends and the square outside case with poured in place urethane foam insulation.  The engine heat exchanger is also stainless.  It was an E-Bay find for $100.

What pictures are you looking for in specific.  I do not know why they disappeared but they did.  Let me know I have lots.



Dale
"Maruska"
Pearson 365 Cutter Ketch
1976 Hull #40
Buffalo, N.Y.

slokat

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2011, 11:43:32 PM »
I've pulled and remounted both of my vent hatches, and there was no balsa in my deck. Were there changes from different years?   (1979 Hull 294)

Dale Tanski

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2011, 09:50:18 AM »
The picture I posted was for a hatch that is in my head area.  It was added by one of the former owners and cut directly through the deck.  The two main 20" x 20" hatches that came with the boat from the factory are set in the deck in preformed openings.  This allowed the factory to provide a finished hole for the underside cabin liner as well as build in a raised curb on the deck to keep water away from the hatch and provide a flat surface on the radiused deck to mount the hatch frame properly.  When you pull the two big hatches there is no exposed balsa core because of this and the overlap of the top deck fiberglass and the liner keeps everything sealed and water out of the core.

On my little head hatch there is no raised curb on the deck.  Even though the hatch is only 10" x 10" the radius of the deck creates a problem as the straight flat edges of the hatch are not tight to the deck because of the decks curve. 

Hope this helps.

Dale
"Maruska"
Pearson 365 Cutter Ketch
1976 Hull #40
Buffalo, N.Y.

Higgins

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2011, 06:46:19 PM »
Great shots.  Sure is a good looking boat.  Any shots with all the canvas up?

Noticed a nice looking toe-rail in one of your pictures.  Did you restore that or build from scratch?

I've got a lot of screw heads that need to be re-countersunk on my toe-rail and I'm trying to figure out the feasibility of the restoration.

Mike
#121
S/V Paradox, #121
1977 Pearson 365 Ketch
Davenport, CA

Dale Tanski

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2011, 02:58:28 PM »
Mike,
Thanks for the nice comments.  Unfortunately I have very few pictures under sail and they are almost from on board.  My toe rail was really bad.  I also considered replacement but after considering the cost decided to give restoration one last try.  I used a hand block plane to smooth a lot of the weathered grain away.  Once the wood was relatively flat, sanding did the trick. 
I saved all of my sanding dust and mixed it with epoxy to make a thickened filler for any cracks and big dings.  I found that just sanding dust and epoxy made a very dark mixture, much darker than the wood itself.   I experimented with adding West #407 Low Density Filler but that also was quite dark red.  West #406 Colloidal Silica was too white but I finally found that West #410 Microlite had a much lighter color mix.  With a little practice, I found I could match the finished color of the wood very nicely with the proper ratio #410 and sanding dust mix.

You can see in this picture some of the filler along the lower strip in a crack that went around the screw.
There are many areas of filler on my teak but they are difficult to see and from 5 miles out it is beautiful. 

I had to lower many of my screws as well.  I removed the screw and redrilled the hole with a tapered countersinking bit.  Mine are made by Fuller and can be purchased at places like Jamestown supply.  What is nice about the Fuller bits is that the tapered drill can be repositioned with the countersink and limit the depth of the drilled hole.
Fuller also makes a nice bung cutter and you can make your own wood bungs out of your teak scraps.
Be careful on the screws that hold the outer strip along the hull.  Do not drill these too deep or they will poke out the bottom of the strip. 
The top of my toerail was so worn that the center grove with the black caulk was even gone in some spots.  This created its own special problem.  I ended up routing the grove deeper with my router and a small diameter straight flat bottom bit.  My router has a fence and I carefully followed the inner edge of the toerail with the fence and followed the groove making it deeper the entire length. I just taped both sides off with masking tape and recalked the new groove with black caulk.  There are many articles on the web about recaulking teak. 
Without a question it was worth the time and effort.
Dale
"Maruska"
Pearson 365 Cutter Ketch
1976 Hull #40
Buffalo, N.Y.

Higgins

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2011, 02:56:55 PM »
Thanks for the shots.  Wow.  That looks really good.  hmmm... maybe more than a Sunday evening project, though.

What's your thought on the minimum depth required to hold a bung?  I was thinking about using black calking in the holes instead of bungs but the result might be a diseased-looking toe-rail.  I've never seen it done so I'm sure there's a good reason not to do it.

Thanks again.

cheers,
mike
S/V Paradox, #121
1977 Pearson 365 Ketch
Davenport, CA

Dale Tanski

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2011, 08:56:18 PM »
Mike,
The teak covering the cockpit caps is now down to somewhere around 1/2" thick.  There is plenty or room for the screw head and then a bung.  Remember even if the countersink starts to go into the base material it is the angle of the screw head that does all of the holding.  I believe an 1/8" of bung is more then enough.
Dale
"Maruska"
Pearson 365 Cutter Ketch
1976 Hull #40
Buffalo, N.Y.

Higgins

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2011, 02:29:38 PM »
Thanks again, Dale.  Looks like I may have enough meat to work with after all.  I'm going to try a few test fills this evening.
S/V Paradox, #121
1977 Pearson 365 Ketch
Davenport, CA

SailingSeaDragon

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2011, 04:58:02 PM »
Dale,

I finally got around to removing Sea Dragon's ports this weekend... What mess. Part of the original negotiation and purchase of the boat was for the previous owner to fix several bad leaks of which rebedding the ports was a big part of the job.... This turned out to be a dumb move on my part as the person that did the work decided that 5200 was the right answer... In 6 hours I was able to remove three (3) of the four (4) ports. And, I made a helluva mess (pictures coming soon) but I did learn several things NOT to do, but not necessarily what to do, when removing fittings 5200ed to the boat…

Now that I have that out my system, I will get to the reason for the post. When removed the ports I found 3/8” gap between the coach roof and the liner around each port… Not the solid glass you show in your picture….. My plan is to purchase 2” by 3/8” FRP from McMaster then glass it into the gap filling any space with thickened west system epoxy. 

Now, everyone any thoughts or suggestions?

Garner
Sea Dragon
1981 36 Cutter (367)
http://www.sailingseadragon.com

Dale Tanski

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2011, 09:31:09 AM »
Garner,

When the boat was still in Havre-de-grave I helped a guy 3 boats away from we remove his bow sprit on a Pacific Seacraft Orion 27.  It was a traditional wooded sprit that tied into the deck with a wooded Samson post arrangement.  Unfortunately it took to rotting and it was entirely bedded with 5200.  I feel your pain.  I could walk away and go back to my own problems, but poor Chris had to stay and stick it out.  He used a product called kryptonite.  Pricey but it sort of worked.  It was a liquid that broke down 5200 but only a little at a time.  We drilled small holes and injected it into the deep sections to help but that job still took several weekends.  Even the 6-7" through bolts were bathed in 5200. Well built and beautiful boat that Orion but what were they thinking!  When it was all said and done, I built him a new quartersawn white oak sprit and post.  The combination of his dark green hull, bronze ports and pretty wood could stop a heart at 100 yards.

Sorry about that trip down memory lane...  Well now you know why your ports leaked.  That gap did not allow the ports to ever tighten up so to speak and for sure the inner liner and outer structure must have moved independently ever so slightly either in a sea, when someone walked down the deck or at the very least thermal expansion.

I love the idea of filler strips.  You are definitely on the right line of thinking here. What about using wood strips lathered in epoxy?  The advantage of wood is that you could custom fit them by sanding or a hand block plane to fit what I am sure is an irregular gap.  Where you can't quite match the profiles, the thickened epoxy will fill.

Another concept is to remove the irregular internal profiles and just use straight strips.  Either way I am thinking you should minimize any irregularities. One method could be a router or a smaller laminate trimmer with this style bit.



It might be a little dicey but should work at making the gap uniform. Just a thought.  If it were me, i guess  I would use wood, shaped to fit and epoxy them in place and use spring clamps to hold the inner and outer skins in place until the epoxy went off, prior to installing the new ports. 

What size ports did you purchase?  I think you already told me they we 5" x 12", but if you purchase 4" x 14" I am making a routing template as we speak. You could have it when I am done so that you were not dependant on acquiring a NMF template.

One last wrinkle.  I am collaborating with Richard from NMF on a little project.  My fixed ports look like crap.  The anodize is wearing away and black marks are streaking the cabin sides.  Initially I was just going to remove my frames and paint them like I did my deck hatches, but once I got them out I rapidly changed my mind.  They are not what I expected, and by the time I painted them, replaced the glass and gasketing they were still really not up to snuff.  In a discussion with Rich, I inquired about just purchasing his external port trim rings to make my own fixed ports. One thing lead to another and I have four external trim pieces (that match the opening ports)  on their way.  He is eliminating the two drainage scoops on the bottom.  They will measure 9" x 24" outside dimensions which is slightly larger all the way around than the four rear fixed ports.

I also had a hunch that Karen Larson from Good Old Boat would have an interest in this project, as there are tons of boats out there that have dying fixed ports with very few options for replacements. She is, and I will be supplying an article for them in the near future detailing the fabrication and installation of the new fixed ports.

So, when you get your opening ports done start planning on new matching rear ports.

Dale
"Maruska"
Pearson 365 Cutter Ketch
1976 Hull #40
Buffalo, N.Y.

BlameItOnBuffett

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Re: Interesting Photos
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2011, 04:25:34 PM »
I haven't had the issue of the gap in the liner on my 365, but did with nmy Ranger 33. I put all new main cabin port holes in it. If you cut luan playwood (I believe it is 1/8th or 1/4 in thickness) into two inch wide strips, it is very easy to work with. I then put them into the gap to figure out whether I needed 1, 2 or 3 for any spot. You can trim it for the opening with a razor knife. When you are ready, just epoxy them together and to the hull to give you a nice solid mating between the two.
Jim & Jo(Ann) Tyson
S/V Blame It On Buffett
Pearson 365 Ketch - Hull# 329