Author Topic: Alcohol Stove  (Read 359 times)

Nereid

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Alcohol Stove
« on: September 18, 2018, 04:17:32 PM »
Does anyone have experience with the Origo 6000 Alcohol Stove?
Or a better question, where to buy a used one??
Thanks all!
S/V Nereid, Hull #193
www.instagram.com/afloataboard/

Maruska

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2018, 09:13:14 PM »
I tried very hard to not reply but I just couldn't do it... I reply the same way when someone comes into my store and inquires about an alcohol stove or worse yet parts for a 40 year old unit, so here goes.
You can't see alcohol burn making it very dangerous.
I produces very little heat when it does.
When it burns it produces a large amount of water vapor in the cabin.
Good fuel is over $20 per gallon.
Is there a good used alcohol stove?
Dale
Obersheimer Sailor Supply
"Maruska"
Pearson 365 Cutter Ketch
1976 Hull #40
Buffalo, N.Y.

Nereid

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2018, 12:08:48 PM »
Dale,
I have heard good things about using alcohol, not to mention who would use good fuel in a stove that can practically take Everclear as a fuel ha. I did look in your store and did not see it for sale.. Many folks argue that having propane is considerably more dangerous.
Do you have a Origo 6000? (apparently they remastered this model to be more on par with a propane stove)
-Nereid
S/V Nereid, Hull #193
www.instagram.com/afloataboard/

Jim S

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2018, 12:44:35 PM »
I have used pressurized and non-pressurized alcohol stoves many times over the years.  I do not regularly use them in my 365 ketch, but I have then available for intermittent use.  Dale is correct that alcohol is hard to see when it is burning...I have an acquaintance that burned his boat up starting a kerosene stove with alcohol.

Most people are burned with alcohol stoves with a fuel flareup during lighting or refilling a hot burner/tank.  If the alcohol gets underneath or behind the stove and catches fire...that is a serious problem.

This being said, I see no reason to exclude them from use totally.  They are particularly good in a smaller boat with a limited galley space where one can monitor them closely (and have a bucket of water nearby).  I prefer the pressurized versions like Kenyon, Homestead, Primus because once the burners are fully lit, they burn like any gas stove.  The non-pressurized stoves do burn with an almost invisible flame.  Parts are hard to find. 

If you want to use one, do serious diligence investigating boating forums to learn more about them.

An alternative may be a Coleman type dual purpose kerosene/white gas single burner gas unit or a butane canister single burner unit commonly seen of TV cooking shows.
Jim S

Nereid

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2018, 02:46:39 PM »
Jim,
I have read similar things about nonpressurized alcohol stoves, but it is my understanding that the Origo models have done a large overhaul to the safety an thermal output.. I think they even have shading for the flame so that you can see it, even in direct light.
What are you thoughts??
S/V Nereid, Hull #193
www.instagram.com/afloataboard/

Jim S

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2018, 05:39:27 PM »
I am  not familiar with any newer or updated technology with these stoves.  They are certainly safe enough to be commercially sold.  If you want one and follow the safety warnings, you will be ok with it.  There is always a trade-off with any stove fuel.  Pick your choice and go cruising.

The stove fuel is available at big box stores sold as alcohol and there will be smaller words that indicate "stove fuel" somewhere on the can.

About once a year or so I threaten to reinstall my original Hillerange pressure alcohol stove.  Nothing ever simmered food better than that burner.
Jim S

Nereid

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2018, 08:45:31 AM »
Awesome, Thanks Jim!
Any one else have 2 sense?
S/V Nereid, Hull #193
www.instagram.com/afloataboard/

Jim S

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2018, 05:22:11 PM »
I was at Home Depot in Houston today buying acetone and a gallon of stove/solvent alcohol was $16.

You interested in a 3 burner Hillerrange pressure alcohol range taken from my 365?  Complete with pressure tank.
Jim S

Hooligan

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #8 on: September 23, 2018, 05:19:43 AM »
 yes we have all heard how dangerous propane is but in over 50 years sailing I have only seen one boat that had a propane explosion. Latitude 38 ( the magazine) ran a story on it. It was big news. Very rare. Alcohol fires are much more common. Alcohol at $16 a gallon. Propane is about $4.00 gallon. Outside the US alcohol is extremely hard to find and very expensive. When I was in Mexico some yachties with alcohol stoves were trying to buy 50 gallons jet fuel for their stoves. There was no alcohol. They went to the airport and said they were buying it for their plane that was down in the desert. The Feds thought they were drug smugglers and arrested them. Moral of the story, donít buy an alcohol stove for your boat or you may be aressted
 

Della and Dave

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2018, 01:25:45 AM »
I have never used alcohol on a boat (at least not to burn, drink is another issue) but I have in other walks of life.  Alcohol is very hydrophilic, so when it gets water mixed in, it just dissolved into the alcohol.  A cup of pure alcohol added to a cup of water is not 2 cups of liquid, significantly less. That means that a lot of alcohol you buy not specifically for fuel use actually has a lot of water in it.  As a solvent, still works fine, but as a fuel, it needs to vaporize all that water which takes a lot of heat away from heating your pot.  The next time you are at a pharmacy, look at the bottle of cheap isopropyl alcohol, it may be only 75% alcohol. 

HEAT as a fuel line drying agent is fairly pure, but the red and yellow bottles are different types of alcohol. 

Alcohol stoves do have one advantage that you will likely not need, they work in really cold weather that is why a lot of high altitude mountain climbers used to use them and why the Iditarod dog mushers use them to heat up food on the trail for the dog teams. 
Della and Dave
S/V Polaris

ZULU40

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2018, 05:50:18 AM »
The Origo 6000 is the model that comes with an oven, I only have a 2 burner stove top

Without attempting to disagree for the sake of it I think these stoves are quite reasonably safe
Theyre not a pressure stove they purely burn vapour, and I can see the flame or it would make it a bit tricky to light, ie. when to stop clicking the electronic match
The one caution I would have is you shouldnt try fill them hot, the device construction wont allow you to open the stove for filling while its on
That is, to open for filling you have to turn the burners to off with the closure that goes over the burners or you cant get it open
You can remove the burners to fill them to help alleviate spills, but even a spill in situ is easy to clean up

I sold my gas range and replaced it with an origo 3000, so why did I do that
I dont like pressure gas stoves, maybe ok for camping but not on a boat. With gas if theres a mistake or a failure, its potentially a big one and your last one
I have electric water heater that runs 12v or 240v and holds 10 gallons of water, so I dont need gas for hot water
I dont use an oven much so I wouldnt be missing it. Visitors be advised, my cooking sucks
The fuel is pretty common and is lighter to carry and haul aboard than gas bottles
Gas bottle fittings vary across the Pacific because there are many intersecting domains with different approaches and regulations
Even in my own state Im not supposed to be fitting or repairing gas devices on a boat, I have to enlist a gas fitter, thats the cost of the stove off of ebay right there
If there is a fire caused by igniting wayward alcohol fuel I can put it out with water, usually theres quite a bit of it handy
NB: the version of alcohol I use is methylated spirits, although its a clear liquid you can smell it, and you can definitely smell it when it burns

Downsides
These things are designed in Sweden manufactured in something called Europe. Parts? Ive no idea but I cant see what could go wrong to need them
I think gas puts out more heat so cooking boiling with alcohol should take longer. I guess I should time how long it takes to boil a pint of water and measure the fuel used
If you run out of fuel I dont think I would refill hot, I just swap to the other burner, or space out and wait
The fuel like all fuels demands some respect, I have an aluminium fuel tank to decant fuel from the tank to the stove, the stuff comes from supermarkets here in disposable 1 ltr bottles
Its not overly unpleasant but you can smell the fuel when it burns, Ive always used the stove with the hatch open
If the stove wasnt near the boats hatch I think I would plan to have some form of forced exhaust vent
Given the fitment on Pearsons usually includes an oven in a bay, I dont know where else you would put it
Which leaves you with the problem of organising your own gimbals and figuring out what to do with the space below it
I put an electric oven in that space within a plywood frame, but its probably only practical off shorepower, although I have a 3000 watt inverter I could use that if 240v want available
My shore power is 120/240 automatic

OK so I hope I was fair to both sides, others have spoken more about risks and perceived risks
Heres an image of what mine looks like,
This is an Origo 3000, same as the top half of the 6000, this was before the gimbal was sorted and the instrument panel rear was fitted

« Last Edit: October 12, 2018, 06:04:54 AM by ZULU40 »
Further South than South is
Hull #103

Jim S

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2018, 08:06:37 AM »
Good looking setup.  Enjoy cruising.  You will be able to eat and have your "cuppa joe".  I do like the simplicity of this burner.
Jim S

ZULU40

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2018, 12:25:57 PM »
thanks Jim

I didnt want to leave this without a few other explanatory shots
when you open the stove by releasing the catch front centre, because the weight goes more rearward it immediately puts the burners in the recommended position for refilling
that is slightly tilted. So that works out ideal

I also wanted to show the simplicity of the internals of the stove, which is simply a SS pressing containing the burners
You can see the burners have a kind of wadding and a mesh cover and can be just slipped out

I also chanced my arm with da fone cam at getting a look at the flame
which although it can be seen it isnt as bright as say gas burners,
and remember this is with mentholated spirits as a fuel because that possibly makes a difference

Further South than South is
Hull #103

Nereid

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2018, 02:45:25 PM »
Not Bad At All!!
Thanks guys for the advice and points! They have all been really helpful!
Thanks for the Flame Photo and walk through Zulu40, helps to see the difference!!
I have been told that you can burn ever-clear in these as well.
Any crazy guy out there done that? Or is it the new thing on the bloc?
S/V Nereid, Hull #193
www.instagram.com/afloataboard/

Nereid

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Re: Alcohol Stove
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2018, 04:14:05 PM »
Also,
Has anyone seen an ORIGO 6000 for sale? (Used.. I prefer to hold on to my pennies).
I do really enjoy the non-pressurized stove ideal a lot!
Thanks!
S/V Nereid, Hull #193
www.instagram.com/afloataboard/